Mage : Frost Vs. Fire

[DayDreamer]

?

[PlayerofRogueC0la]

fire

[Baxxor]

sigh, hate theese polls.
You need to say what ya need it for.
PvE or PvP?
you need to say what you are going to do, not just ask wich is best
both are good...

[Private]

think its kinda obvious if ur lvling u wanna fire but i also think in pvp frost would be best for kiting (btw i think kite is gay it should be called something else) and group pk

i really haven't seen much of arcane tho i hate that shitchanneling nething is dummb

[Eric]

frost in PvP, fire in PvE

[PADDY]

think its kinda obvious if ur lvling u wanna fire but i also think in pvp frost would be best for kiting (btw i think kite is gay it should be called something else) and group pk

i really haven't seen much of arcane tho i hate that shitchanneling nething is dummb[/b]

thats horribly inaccurate :P

frost is easily the best for leveling :P

aoe leveling improved blizzard is a must, and for single target leveling frost is brilliant for the crit chance on frozen targets.

ATM arcane fire mages are awesome in arenas when they can afford to just blow all thier mana in a matter of seconds, in areanas i find ice mages struggle due to the number of ways people can now avoid being slowed :P

in raids i often fins fire will be higher on the damage meters, but thats in 25 man things where the tank is able to get alot of agro. In 5 man instances i find frost to be better, the improved ability to slow/freeze as well as the low agro pulling spells and ice block when needed (very useful for moroes) for me makes frost superior in 5 mans. The one way a fire mage can benefit a party is improved scorch which'll benefit the likes of warlocks

[Eric]

In PvP it all depends on their opponents really.

My partner is zero, a rogue and I'm a feral Druid. We've actually reached 1856 rating in 2v2 with that kind of pairing, where 3/4s of teams have a MAJOR advantage against us. Now frost mages with double ice block until the next patch are a nightmare to us. We can't sap them, they will ice block or if gnome escape artist. We can't blind then because of ice block, until the next patch where we can sap then blind after they ice block once and have the hypothermia debuff.

So this leaves us with cyclone which can be easily countered and doesnt last near the time of the other CCs. So now lets say we fight a group with a paladin/ice mage for instance.

1st tactic:
- sap mage (breaks with ice block)
- nuke paladin into bubble
- blind mage after he ice blocks out of sap (either breaks with second ice block or paladin cures the blind)
- cyclone mage hoping that the paladin has bubble by now (if the mage is halfway decent he will counterspell me before I get it off)
- Die horribly by being slowed to death by a mage with a paladin spamming himself with blessing of freedom to avoid crippling

2nd tactic:
- sap paladin (hopefully to force bubble, but any good paladin knows to just wait out the sap)
- nuke mage (at this point he will ice block for the entire duration while his partner waits out the sap)
- blind paladin (at this point mage is out of ice block-
- nuke mage (cold snap and re iceblock and waits for blind to end, or he can easily just kite both of us if decent)
- cyclone paladin (at this point theres no way to kill a mage in 6 seconds with our grouping even if I dont get counterspelled)


Now fire mage/paladin can be hard as well, however it can be much easier too.

1st tactic:
- sap mage (if he isnt a gnome so he cant break sap with escape artist)
- nuke paladin into bubble (if the paladin is halfway decent and knows how to utilize blessing of freedom while kiting us its much easier and we may not force the bubble before the sap/blind wear off)
- blind mage (hopefully the blind goes off before the idiot pom pyros like the shitty twat he is)
- given that the paladin is too much of an idiot to cure his partners blind we can get away far enough to restealth and open again
- now reopen on paladin while either sapping mage or me cycloning him (usually cyclone)
- hope that we can damage the paladin enough to kill him before the mage kills us BOTH at the same time.

Can't be bothered writing anymore, it's simply turned into a rant about mages and blessing of freedom. (against rogues and ice mages I can't think of a more imbalanced skill as BoF)

These same tactics apply to warrior as well, however we cant sap a warrior and if the paladin is halfway decent we can never nuke him during a cyclone/blind if he uses blessing of freedom to avoid crippling,

[Baxxor]

Pve and exp:
Frost, everyone want a frost mage for pve and it's easier to exp as frost.


PvP:
Arcane, not fire!
put enough points into fire so you get pyroblast. rest into arcane

[0000000]

fire mages are shite in pvp, they are too easy to kill. the best mage pvp spec is 41 frost.

[PADDY]

fire mages are shite in pvp, they are too easy to kill. the best mage pvp spec is 41 frost.[/b]

2 x pom pyroblast mage and a rogue is like the ultimate 3v3 set up

[Eric]

2 x pom pyroblast mage and a rogue is like the ultimate 3v3 set up[/b]

easy as hell to kill for my 3v3 undergeared/not well experienced 3v3 group.

Shaman, rogue, feral druid.
Shamn goes ghost wolf cant be sapped, rogue saps 1 mage blinds other or I cyclone other, and nuke rogue.

3v3 is not damage damage damage, we rape full damage groups and get raped by resto groups because our pairing is so flawed.

[0000000]

2 x pom pyroblast mage and a rogue is like the ultimate 3v3 set up[/b]

none of them can heal, all of them are easy to CC and have no escapes. That sort of gimmick team probably can do well at low ratings but against people with 300+ resilience the double pyroblast wont do enough damage to kill anyone. 1 sap, or 1 fear and 2 of them are dead instantly.

I'm not sure what the best 3v3 matrix is, but the team that won the 3v3 wcg in china was holy paladin, ms warrior and frost mage. Another powerful matrix is holy priest, combat or mutilate rogue, affliction warlock. I think any good 3v3 team requires either an offensive or defensive dispeller.

[Baxxor]

sigh, doesn't care if you cc a fire mage.
there is yet another one that can get ya down in a sec, in bg's now days it aint about who survives the longest.
it's about who hits hardest and who hits first, fire mage is best since you cant really do sh*t if your dead..

[0000000]

and thats why battlegrounds are filled with pom-pyro carebears in pve gear who go and write "nerf clos" threads after they die. bg's dont matter, there is very little worthwhile competition there.

Like you said, you can't do shit if youre dead. And trust me, firemages are walking punch bags. Frost mages biggest boon is the double iceblock and elemental, without it pom-pyro mages are targets every time they blink. They can be dropped 100>0 in one kidney shot duration.

Fire is definately king in PvE, but if i see a fire mage in arena i dont care who his partner is because it is free points.

[PADDY]

advantage of PoM Pyro Mages is that they get the benefits of the arcane tree as well, improved counterspell, increased spell dmg etc. As an ice mage you really have to fully skill ice (maybe 10-15 points spare) in order to get the most out of pvp.

Dont forget fully skilling the arcane tree you can get a slowing ability not to mention the 10% chance to stun with fire spells.