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K2's Policies Bent Again?

This is a discussion on K2's Policies Bent Again? within the General Chat forums, part of the Knight Online (ko4life.com) category; Originally posted by Yun_Yuuzhan+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Yun_Yuuzhan)</div> Originally posted by Rentzusuken+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rentzusuken) <!--QuoteBegin-Yun_Yuuzhan @ <!--QuoteBegin-priestish I smell jealousy Do you think you're ...
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  1. #16
    Rentzusuken
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    Originally posted by Yun_Yuuzhan+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Yun_Yuuzhan)</div>
    Originally posted by Rentzusuken+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rentzusuken)
    <!--QuoteBegin-Yun_Yuuzhan
    @
    <!--QuoteBegin-priestish

    I smell jealousy


    Do you think you're funny? It's impossible to be jealous of a cheater, that would imply they actually earned what they have.
    Jealousy doesn't stem from the knowledge that someone earned the thing which is desired, but merely possess it.[/b]
    jealousy

    n 1: a feeling of jealous envy (especially of a rival) [syn: green-eyed monster] 2: zealous vigilance; "cherish their official political freedom with fierce jealousy"-Paul Blanshard

    Source: WordNet 2.0, 2003 Princeton University

    jealousy

    suspicion of a wife's purity, one of the strongest passions (Num. 5:14; Prov.
    6:34; Cant. 8:6); also an intense interest for another's honour or prosperity

    (Ps. 79:5; 1 Cor. 10:22; Zech. 1:14).

    Source: Easton's 1897 Bible Dictionary


    Dunno about you, but to me, a rival that either has honor or prosperity actually earned it. I don't want level 70 overnight, I want to do it fair and square by myself, because that actually has meaning. Fuck cheaters, I want them banned, I don't want what they have.[/b][/quote]

    I'm well aware of the definitions of the word, but notice that it is due to intense emotion. As you can see every day, intense emotion is not conjoined with logic, thus the knowledge or concept that someone earned the object of desire does not come into play, but merely the fact that they have something you do not. As a matter of fact, if you are reasonable enough to look at someone and say "they earned that, damnit, and I want it too!" you are more likely to see what steps they took to get it and plan accordingly than follow up with a preposterous thought that just because they have it you should also. Wanting something simply because someone else has it is jealousy; wanting something that someone has and recognizing that they earned it segues into a very different mindset of planning to achieve a shared goal.

    I've never seen a case of jealousy where someone was cognizant of any effort expended to achieve whatever is in question, but always seen where someone is simply emotional over a possession they do not have that someone else does. Therefore, to me, it is implausible that someone jealous of anyone's level is in that state because of any effort expended, but simply because they are not that level and cannot see past the chemical reactions causing the emotion. I agree with "fuck cheaters", but fuck K2 also for allowing them. Anybody who is known as a cheater does not have honor within the community, and prosperity is relative although I would venture that people who have XX level are not seen as being prosperous in any way. If we are to argue that people gain honor and prosperity with XX level, then surely we ascertain that you get the same after XX years of living?

  2. #17
    Yun_Yuuzhan
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    Originally posted by HeLLorY+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(HeLLorY)</div>
    @Yun_Yuuzhan

    we all know that k2 has not strict restrictions to the third party tool programs. everyday users who use them get larger and larger, wiseverse the users do not use them get smaller in quantity. of course playing fair (i don't only mean not using koxp also the moralities of xp spots and boss killings, pk moralities etc.) is the best thing and i also seek for it. but, in my opinion staying fairplayer in ko under these conditions gets harder and harder. there is not sufficient punishment to the guilts also no more gm's online on servers tend people be guilty in ko. for that reasons, i purchased koxp and start to lvl by using it. i were lvl 61 when i started koxp and got 68 lvl after the 27 days period, 28th period i got banned and tomarrow my account will be unbanned. and i know that they won't delvl my char to 63. becouse k2 can't do it. they are only showmens. am i happy? yes, but i won't use koxp again becouse i got enough lvl's. playing fair ko (mean getting xp and lvl) is nothing for me. go lvl 70 with koxp and pk on cz :wub: *

    i know i will get too many messages including sangs but really i dont mind it. i just wanted to explain a koxper's feelings^^

    until k2 really set strict punishments to unfair players, i will go on gettin lvl in that way [/b]
    I'd rather quit than resort to that.

    Originally posted by Rentzusuken+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rentzusuken)</div>
    Originally posted by Yun_Yuuzhan
    Originally posted by Rentzusuken
    <!--QuoteBegin-Yun_Yuuzhan
    @
    <!--QuoteBegin-priestish

    I smell jealousy


    Do you think you're funny? It's impossible to be jealous of a cheater, that would imply they actually earned what they have.


    Jealousy doesn't stem from the knowledge that someone earned the thing which is desired, but merely possess it.


    jealousy

    n 1: a feeling of jealous envy (especially of a rival) [syn: green-eyed monster] 2: zealous vigilance; "cherish their official political freedom with fierce jealousy"-Paul Blanshard

    Source: WordNet 2.0, 2003 Princeton University

    jealousy

    suspicion of a wife's purity, one of the strongest passions (Num. 5:14; Prov.
    6:34; Cant. 8:6); also an intense interest for another's honour or prosperity

    (Ps. 79:5; 1 Cor. 10:22; Zech. 1:14).

    Source: Easton's 1897 Bible Dictionary


    Dunno about you, but to me, a rival that either has honor or prosperity actually earned it. I don't want level 70 overnight, I want to do it fair and square by myself, because that actually has meaning. Fuck cheaters, I want them banned, I don't want what they have.
    I'm well aware of the definitions of the word, but notice that it is due to intense emotion. As you can see every day, intense emotion is not conjoined with logic, thus the knowledge or concept that someone earned the object of desire does not come into play, but merely the fact that they have something you do not. As a matter of fact, if you are reasonable enough to look at someone and say "they earned that, damnit, and I want it too!" you are more likely to see what steps they took to get it and plan accordingly than follow up with a preposterous thought that just because they have it you should also. Wanting something simply because someone else has it is jealousy; wanting something that someone has and recognizing that they earned it segues into a very different mindset of planning to achieve a shared goal.

    I've never seen a case of jealousy where someone was cognizant of any effort expended to achieve whatever is in question, but always seen where someone is simply emotional over a possession they do not have that someone else does. Therefore, to me, it is implausible that someone jealous of anyone's level is in that state because of any effort expended, but simply because they are not that level and cannot see past the chemical reactions causing the emotion. I agree with "fuck cheaters", but fuck K2 also for allowing them. Anybody who is known as a cheater does not have honor within the community, and prosperity is relative although I would venture that people who have XX level are not seen as being prosperous in any way. If we are to argue that people gain honor and prosperity with XX level, then surely we ascertain that you get the same after XX years of living?[/b]
    I hate to sound cliched, but you've now seen a case of this. If someone cheated to get their level and I know that, I don't care if they are 90 if full +10 items, I want them banned, fuck them. I don't want what they have. I daresay I am reasonable enough to see people that made level 70 before me without cheating and try to figure out how they did it. Ergo, many hours spent at trolls, harpies, golems, apo, etc. Sometimes they also had a 2nd or 3rd person playing their character, but that is not a viable option for me. I'm of the school of thought, if they did it, so can I, I just have to figure out how. Even if it means mimicking someone to some extent without resorting to KOxp.

  3. #18
    Rentzusuken
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    So you're saying that you are jealous of these cheaters who are a higher level than you?

  4. #19
    Yun_Yuuzhan
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    Originally posted by Rentzusuken
    So you're saying that you are jealous of these cheaters who are a higher level than you?
    Show me where I said that?

  5. #20
    leftclaw
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    Meh. So, rather than trying to be a solution to the problem, you actually contribute just to cope up with the race? Nice sense of mentality you have there hellory. ^^

  6. #21
    Rentzusuken
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    Originally posted by Rentzusuken
    I've never seen a case of jealousy where someone was cognizant of any effort expended to achieve whatever is in question, but always seen where someone is simply emotional over a possession they do not have that someone else does. *Therefore, to me, it is implausible that someone jealous of anyone's level is in that state because of any effort expended, but simply because they are not that level and cannot see past the chemical reactions causing the emotion. *I agree with "fuck cheaters", but fuck K2 also for allowing them. *Anybody who is known as a cheater does not have honor within the community, and prosperity is relative although I would venture that people who have XX level are not seen as being prosperous in any way. *If we are to argue that people gain honor and prosperity with XX level, then surely we ascertain that you get the same after XX years of living?

    Originally posted by Yun_Yuuzhan
    I hate to sound cliched, but you've now seen a case of this.

  7. #22
    Yun_Yuuzhan
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    Originally posted by Rentzusuken+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rentzusuken)</div>
    <!--QuoteBegin-Rentzusuken
    I've never seen a case of jealousy where someone was cognizant of any effort expended to achieve whatever is in question, but always seen where someone is simply emotional over a possession they do not have that someone else does. *Therefore, to me, it is implausible that someone jealous of anyone's level is in that state because of any effort expended, but simply because they are not that level and cannot see past the chemical reactions causing the emotion. *I agree with "fuck cheaters", but fuck K2 also for allowing them. *Anybody who is known as a cheater does not have honor within the community, and prosperity is relative although I would venture that people who have XX level are not seen as being prosperous in any way. *If we are to argue that people gain honor and prosperity with XX level, then surely we ascertain that you get the same after XX years of living?

    Originally posted by Yun_Yuuzhan
    I hate to sound cliched, but you've now seen a case of this.
    [/b]
    You sir, would be very good at writing contracts Are you a lawyer?

    The point I meant to get across was that not everyone is just blindly jealous of cheaters' levels and items. There are those that hate them and want them banned, and to further discredit a cheater's "accomplishments", we will level and farm legitly to prove it is possible for people willing to expend the effort.

  8. #23
    Rentzusuken
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    Originally posted by Yun_Yuuzhan
    You sir, would be very good at writing contracts *Are you a lawyer?

    The point I meant to get across was that not everyone is just blindly jealous of cheaters' levels and items. *There are those that hate them and want them banned, and to further discredit a cheater's "accomplishments", we will level and farm legitly to prove it is possible for people willing to expend the effort.
    I agree, but with my initial statement of "Jealousy doesn't stem from the knowledge that someone earned the thing which is desired, but merely possess it." I am pointing out that the statement you set forth "It's impossible to be jealous of a cheater, that would imply they actually earned what they have." may not be entirely correct as recognition of achievement is a quality not found in those who exhibit jealousy.

    The comraderie is a great thing in this game, but it is not formidable enough to fight the constant drawbacks to investing time and money into it. The simple fact remains that despite how much effort you put into discrediting and superceding the cheaters within this game, they will always win. The company "running" (and trust me I use that term loosely because it's obvious they just let things happen instead of control how they should proceed) this game has a policy of inaction at the very core and cannot be overpowered by the few GMs who tried to change things as is evidenced by their untimely demise. Some may see quitting the game as throwing in the towel, but for me it's a sucker-punch to the face and a kick in the nuts because both my time and money will be better spent.

  9. #24
    Yun_Yuuzhan
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    Originally posted by Rentzusuken+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rentzusuken)</div>
    <!--QuoteBegin-Yun_Yuuzhan
    You sir, would be very good at writing contracts *Are you a lawyer?

    The point I meant to get across was that not everyone is just blindly jealous of cheaters' levels and items. *There are those that hate them and want them banned, and to further discredit a cheater's "accomplishments", we will level and farm legitly to prove it is possible for people willing to expend the effort.
    I agree, but with my initial statement of "Jealousy doesn't stem from the knowledge that someone earned the thing which is desired, but merely possess it." I am pointing out that the statement you set forth "It's impossible to be jealous of a cheater, that would imply they actually earned what they have." may not be entirely correct as recognition of achievement is a quality not found in those who exhibit jealousy.

    The comraderie is a great thing in this game, but it is not formidable enough to fight the constant drawbacks to investing time and money into it. The simple fact remains that despite how much effort you put into discrediting and superceding the cheaters within this game, they will always win. The company "running" (and trust me I use that term loosely because it's obvious they just let things happen instead of control how they should proceed) this game has a policy of inaction at the very core and cannot be overpowered by the few GMs who tried to change things as is evidenced by their untimely demise. Some may see quitting the game as throwing in the towel, but for me it's a sucker-punch to the face and a kick in the nuts because both my time and money will be better spent.[/b]
    Forgive me for getting philosophical, but cheaters do not win. They may have more NP, more levels, or more items, but they didn't earn them. In their heart they know this even if no one else does. Should it be known they are just another cheater, then they do not get the respect and acknowledgement that earning something within the rules receives, thereby invalidating whatever 'achievement' they think they may have gotten. Further, it's quite arguable that since they went outside the rules, they aren't even playing the same game as everyone else, and therefore, they lose more than anyone and are only deceiving themselves that they are anything except scum that couldn't cut it within the rules. It is pointless to agree to play a game if you aren't going to follow the established rules for that game. From an empirical perspective, it is impossible to win a game if you break the rules because to "win" is to follow all the rules and still come out on top.

    "The liar's punishment is not in the least that he cannot be believed, but in that he is unable to believe anyone else."

    Cheaters are much like liars - they deceive themselves into thinking they've won.

  10. #25
    TunaFishyMe
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    In the system of the game, they are considered losers bit om the system of games, they are winners. Why do we xp? Because we enjoy it? No. We enjoy to pk. We xp so we can get even on pking and enjoy that. We play games for enjoyment. Macroers are skipping the painful xping and are jumping right into pk, the enjoyment of this game. In essence, they are enjoying the game more than we are.

  11. #26
    Rentzusuken
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    Tuna has it right there. Philosphy is alot of fun, but Reality is always there waiting for when you are done. The aims in this game are to get NP, and levels help considerably in this aim. If you cut out the time needed to get the levels you want, you increase the time you can invest in gaining NP. With having more time to invest, you invariably will be able to gain more than people who are just XPing and once you get whatever goals you had in mind, you can quit and move along. Most of the people who cheat in a game such as this simply want their moment in the limelight before selling, and it didn't take them two years to get to that point.

  12. #27
    Yun_Yuuzhan
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    Originally posted by Rentzusuken
    Tuna has it right there. *Philosphy is alot of fun, but Reality is always there waiting for when you are done. *The aims in this game are to get NP, and levels help considerably in this aim. *If you cut out the time needed to get the levels you want, you increase the time you can invest in gaining NP. *With having more time to invest, you invariably will be able to gain more than people who are just XPing and once you get whatever goals you had in mind, you can quit and move along. *Most of the people who cheat in a game such as this simply want their moment in the limelight before selling, and it didn't take them two years to get to that point.
    Exactly, and who points a limelight at them if they are a known cheater? They can 'enjoy' the game all they want, people have different ways of enjoyment. I get bored of xp, yes, but to me, working towards a goal within the rules is extremely fun. The ones most likely to want instant gratification are kids and those losers are never worthy of respect.

  13. #28
    Rentzusuken
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    Originally posted by Yun_Yuuzhan
    Exactly, and who points a limelight at them if they are a known cheater? They can 'enjoy' the game all they want, people have different ways of enjoyment. *I get bored of xp, yes, but to me, working towards a goal within the rules is extremely fun. *The ones most likely to want instant gratification are kids and those losers are never worthy of respect.
    This very forum puts the limelight on them. How many cheaters have their names mentioned here daily? How many times do people post angrily and full of emotion while the perpetrator sits back and laughs? As in show business, even "bad" publicity is still publicity. If they want "legit" recognition of their "accomplishments" they'll have to wait for K2 to fix the website again, but it once was a tribute to those who cheated to get ahead because not only was the results of their actions shown for all to see, but no punishment was meted out either. Sounds like a win-win situation to me.

  14. #29
    Yun_Yuuzhan
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    Originally posted by Rentzusuken+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rentzusuken)</div>
    <!--QuoteBegin-Yun_Yuuzhan
    Exactly, and who points a limelight at them if they are a known cheater? They can 'enjoy' the game all they want, people have different ways of enjoyment. *I get bored of xp, yes, but to me, working towards a goal within the rules is extremely fun. *The ones most likely to want instant gratification are kids and those losers are never worthy of respect.
    This very forum puts the limelight on them. How many cheaters have their names mentioned here daily? How many times do people post angrily and full of emotion while the perpetrator sits back and laughs? As in show business, even "bad" publicity is still publicity. If they want "legit" recognition of their "accomplishments" they'll have to wait for K2 to fix the website again, but it once was a tribute to those who cheated to get ahead because not only was the results of their actions shown for all to see, but no punishment was meted out either. Sounds like a win-win situation to me.[/b]
    Precisely, they are ridiculed, not admired. Being well known does not make you great. Having high NP doesn't mean you can PK. If negative attention is what they seek, well, they'll get that no matter what if they choose to be so immature all the time. I think we can agree positive attention is worth far more than negative attention, no matter what "show business" would have you think.

    Think of it this way, you win when everyone agrees you did. Cheaters get "you suck" from most players. How does that equate winning again? Their numbers might be superior but the method that they got that way was not valid. Here's some food for thought: Do you want a computer to say you "won", or the entire community to say you "won"? The answer should be pretty universal.

  15. #30
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    i thought the delvl was automatic i was banned and unbanned in seconds but still was delvl'd days later and had to have the gm fix my lvls

    think gm has to tell someone to delvl and that someone probly didn't give 2 shits bout viet tiger


    i know real viettiger from runescape this kid jus a wanna be

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