376LikesWhat clan? I might know some of em.Originally Posted by Kallop
This is a discussion on Zone MYKO (Stay tuned) within the Private Servers forums, part of the Knight Online (ko4life.com) category; Originally Posted by Kallop
Possibly. Haven't really thought about recruiting much though. Literally just called old buddies to hang out ...
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What clan? I might know some of em.
They're all old members of FinalLegacy. The clan I've been running for 4 years or so, maybe longer who knows.
Played this server before, as a mage. Everyone left when they nerfed the mages, I got bored and left, gave away all my shits. logged in yesterday, remembered in a few minutes why I left, got bored and left again.
Yup i felt the same, seems like its active but it was seriously boring, most of people were just merchanting at times when i play, burned and gave up all my shits tho.. :P
Last edited by SacruM; 04-24-2017 at 02:19 AM.
It does have some semi decent pk when its peak time,but its rather hard for new players to catch up thats why theres barely any new blood in the server. We started again as mages and we got some basic shit,but if you want to start as a melee clan you will have to farm your ass off if you want to be able to compete,but its kinda not worth it tbh.
This has been copied from the Zone MYKO forums for people using KO4Life only to see. The discussion about this topic in particular should preferably remain in Zone MYKO forums.
As many of you have noticed, FinalLegacy started playing in Zone MYKO again. Since it's my duty as the commander and clan leader to take care of my clan members, I ran some testing prior to us actually joining. Here are my results and my thoughts about the results and possible solutions.
Best possible mage gear in the server, without a doubt, is as follows:
- Papermage set+9
- Lupus staff +9
- Iron Set
- Dual LB+2 (Flame Rings, Imir Rings and Shio's Tears only increase staff skill damage.)
- Dual LKP+2
Why? Well, apparently staff AP doesn't have any effect in a mage's damage output, which means that the best mage gear is optimized based on maximum health and resists, with a little weapon defense of course. Another important thing to note is that lightning, fire and ice mages do exactly the same damage. This is a HUGE problem, as this means that the following items are WORTHLESS:
- Chaotic staff
- Elysium
- Garp
- Lightning Erenion
- Scorching Staff
- Hell Blood
- Glacier Erenion
- Wrath Of Erenion
- Lycaon Staff
- Lobo Staff
As many of you know, a full party if light/ice mages is pretty much cancer. I heard from some sources that mages were overpowered, so they were nerfed (not sure how, just heard about it) and they added hidden resistances to armors. Well, after a series of testing, we concluded that average mage nova damage ranges from 650 to 900, depending on the target's resistances. With the addition of black chitins and juraid jewelry, the combined health and resistances is far too high for this amount of damage. Basically mage damage is still at the level of a 60 cap server, while warriors and priests have stats for lvl 80 characters.
I'm not entirely sure about the stats of warriors in this server, but our cheaply geared priest has 7000 HP, while according to a friend warriors have around 8000 HP. I don't know about rogues, but I assume they're around 5-6k HP. So let's do some basic math with the information we have.
A normal melee party:
- 2-3 Priests with 2 10k party heals
- 5 Warriors
- 1 Mage OR 1 Rogue
A normal mage party:
- 7 mages
- 1 priest
So average nova damage is 775 and a top melee team warrior should have around 8000 HP (7000-8000)
8000/775 = 10.3225806 ~10 (Warrior)
7000/775 = 9.03225806 ~9 (Priest)
5000/775 = 6.4516129 ~ 7 (Rogue. Rounds down to 6, but that's 0,45 margin so..)
775*7 = 5425 + DoT (Obviously the average damage a mage team does in a single instance to a single target)
This means that even with frame perfect coordination, a mage team is incapable of killing a melee party with their novas. The argument could be made that if mages could one-shot melees they would be overpowered, but that requires and INSANE amount of synergy within the mage team. And none of the mage teams (us included) in this server have such synergy. In a case where the melees know exactly what they're doing, the warriors use their health potions immediately after they've taken damage, so now their health is going to be 8000-5425+720 = 3295. This means that the next set of novas would successfully kill the warriors, but the problem is that they always have at least 1, and more often than not, 2 priests with 10k party heal to save their ass. In newer servers mage damage is MUCH higher and even then priests are capable of healing a melee party with a single 10k heal, but in Zone MYKO, the timing is much wider and forgiving. In fact, it seems like it's almost impossible for a priest to fuck up healing their party unless they're actually garbage. These numbers are in a vacuum scenario, so we aren't really taking into count the various strategies put into place to counteract damage, but in short it's simply far too easy for a melee party to survive the initial damage from mages, which is the only real damage mages deal without putting themselves in a real danger.
None of this would be a problem, but there's another issue. Mages are REALLY easy to kill. Warriors with +8 weapons hit for anywhere between 850-1100. Assassins can actually hit up to 2000 with spike. Mages die in less than a second and the priest has a very slight chance of saving the life of a paper mage (which again, is the only build any mage should ever be if they want to survive and do maximum damage).
Further explanation why it's unhealthy for a server to have lightning/ice/fire to do equal damage. There is absolutely no reason the play fire mage. Lightning has cancel and stun, ice has AoE slow, fire has a shitty DoT. Basically only idiots would play fire. Especially when the best items in the game offer you FR. Ice is the best for damage and lightning for the bonus effects. This needs to change. Fire has to deal more damage than ice or lightning.
A pretty simple solution to all problems mentioned above, with the exception of the staff AP of course. Lower the damage of lightning skills (namely the novas) by 50-150 and increase the damage of fire skills by 150-200. Even if mages deal 900-1000 damage with fire novas, they can't stun you, they can't slow you, they can only KILL you. They're still very easy to kill and they have almost no real way of stopping you from doing so if you press your buttons correctly. Staff damage is still very low. In servers that use newer versions, mages are capable of using armors that give them more HP and their staff damage is also higher. You could tank for a while and survive and use your skills multiple times before losing the fight, but in Zone MYKO you can only survive for 5-10 seconds at max.
TL;DR -
FIRE mage damage is too low and it should be changed due to the amount of health and resistances melee parties have. Lightning mages shouldn't deal as much damage to avoid having 7-20 lightning mages running together stunning and killing everybody. I don't want mages to become overpowered, but it seems hardly fair at it's current state. Especially when some of the priests have shown that they're capable of healing mage AoE rather well. As well as the melees starting to finally use descent to their advantage. Also it seems hardly reasonable that a lightning mage with Wood Staff +8 deals the same damage as a fire mage with WoE+8 or Scorching+8.
P.S -
No idea why staff AP is useless. I can't recall whether it was always like this, but it seems counterproductive because it would probably also work as a solution to our problem. Staves with high AP would climb in price and it would force mages to actually buy gear in order to deal damage rather than get Lycaon Staff/Lupus Staff, which are also the cheapest and easiest weapons to get funny enough.
P.S 2 -
I assume someone is going to point out that mages are doing fine, because several clans are running together with 15-20 mages in a group, but you must realize that 15 warriors is just as destructive as 15 mages, if not even worse. Just because people run in big groups, it doesn't mean a class is balanced.
It's good, mage teams are boring anywayFinally a server that's forcing melee teams again, melee = skill FTW always and 4 life. Screw nova clickers xD Btw Staff attack power does affect aoe damage kallop. Try wood+8 and scorching+8 and u'll see
I would not write a wall of text without actually testing. I tested Lupus+7 VS. Chaotic +7, same dmg. Then I tested Wood Staff +8 VS. Lupus+7, same dmg. THEN I tested Wood+8 Lightning VS. WoE+7 Fire and the result is unsurprisingly, same dmg.It's good, mage teams are boring anyway
I realized while writing this reply, that I actually stated that I ran these tests in the original post, which means you didn't even bother reading it before replying. Oh well. The whole point is that in most servers staff AP should affect your skill damage, but for whatever reason that is not the case in Zone MYKO and it needs to get fixed. If that in itself is enough to create class balance, then that's good.
Edit: I actually feel like pointing out it's the first paragraph of the actual post where I state I've run the tests, which lead to this analysis, but I guess you decided to reply simply based on context. I know you hate mages Klemen.
thisIt's good, mage teams are boring anyway
is the most stupid thing i have ever seen you post
a server without mages is a dead server, you nerf mages they leave and in time the melee's leave (new server launch)
so this is probally why bazingako has the activity of a tunafish.
Why would you post this on KO4Life without expecting a discussion and even adding that it should be kept to their random forums?
and here we go, mage teams crying they suck
Here comes the cancer train !
Hold on getting Popcorn!
The part you quoted actually has the explanation. I knew there were a few people who can't see the topic on their forums, so I posted it here in order for them to see it. I'm not going to stop discussion from happening in here, but it is preferable to continue the discussion using their forums rather than cluttering KO4Life with it. Especially since there are already people replying to the post without input or without having played the server.
There's no crying involved. It's called constructive criticism in case this is the first time you've witnessed such a thing in your life.and here we go, mage teams crying they suck
So far things have progressed as I suspected. Melee teams only recognize the parts they dislike. There are various small things that should get changed, but the thing people take from this wall of text is "buff mages". What should be much more concerning is the fact that the 2nd best mage weapon in the game is a fucking wood staff +8. Also, in case you've ever played 12xx servers in the past. You should know very well that 7 lightning mages is much more cancer to deal with than 7 fire mages. So in fact, the proposed change should PLEASE melee clans, rather than irritate them. But hey, logic was never the strong suit of KO players.
i actually did play the server, and i do understand it's hard to beat a melee party, but it's supposed to be that way due to warriors having enough HP and resistances.
to beat a melee party as a mage party you need the right coordination and teamplay, combined with the right timing on parasite debuffs, curing torment and positioning. usually 2 priests are required to straight up fight a 8v8 against melee party's which ofcourse you stubborn asses can't handle to accept.
if your team isn't capable of doing that i indeed agree crying for a mage buff is all there's left to do.
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