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Lower ice %

This is a discussion on Lower ice % within the General Chat forums, part of the Knight Online (ko4life.com) category; How many aoe ice spells do u get lvl 70-75? more than one im sure. So basically count only the ...
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  1. #241
    Senior Member SilverBlade's Avatar
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    How many aoe ice spells do u get lvl 70-75? more than one im sure. So basically count only the aoe ice spells and then times by amount of time they slow that is the itme curently available to one ice mage in a party times it by two when there is anyone. Then count in your head that amount of time and see how OMG this is a long time. Or better yet run around with no swift the whole time and u will have half an idea of what its like.[/b]
    I am not sure you understand how mage works. Before suggesting/requesting changes to the class, please try to understand this. No, we dont get an unlimited number of aoe's from 70 to 75. We get 1 aoe at 45, one at 60 and one at 70. I am not counting the lvl 33 because its almost useless in pk. We can have another lvl 45 in the secondary skill tree (so it does not slow), but usually we have to sacrifice something from the main tree or the masters to get it. And aoe's have nasty cooldowns - that is even if you have 4 (although 4th should not count actually as it does not slow) they still can't be spammed in sequence - far from it actually. The second mage is needed to cover my cooldowns. Also, think that I might need to throw them at more than one direction in crowded fights. You also have to take into account cures. Icing only lasts 20 seconds if you don't have a priest.

    Mages are not immune to ice, so we know how it is. But honestly, I dont spend all my time being iced, even when raiding ew and even if I dont have a party curer. If you read the previous pages of the thread, u will see that it seems to be a warrior issue most of the time. And in any case I am not sure I would mind so much being unswifted if that also meant I had 500 more ac

    The fact that so many changed to ice shows that it has become unbalanced. NO other class has a success rate on those types of skills.[/b]
    No, it actually means it was unbalanced before the other way round and no-one wanted to be ice back then. In my clan there are only 2 ice mages, one HP and one MP build in a total of 10 or so. Granted, before the patch there was only me so 1 in 10, but still I see too many non-ice mages.
    The fact that ice-mage related equipment is still the cheapest of the 3 shows that ice is not the dominant element.
    Unfortunately, it is no longer as cheap as it used to be.


    redice the slowed time to like 5 seconds. not 20 seconds and have cooldown so there is a chance for a 1v1. % seconds is enough to get away unless its a sin but they can cure and run faster than u anyway or just attack in slteath.[/b]
    Ice is not only an escape technique - we have gate for that or /town or a tp-er. Its a weapon to be used to win a fight, especially a party vs. party - not only a way to run away.
    Also, you are looking at this for a vs. point of view which tbh, I could not care less about. Why do you expect an ice mage to vs u? How is an HP ice mage supposed to have any chance of killing a reasonable warrior in a 1 vs 1 ffs? Maybe you cant kill me when I bring up shileds and defence armours, but I will never kill you either while spamming 250+30 dmg with the helloween cane, which is the ONLY 1-handed staff available to me. Its like asking for a balanced 1vs1 with an INT build support priest that does not have any duffs.
    I am not interested in vs. you, point. I want to ice you to keep you away from me and then tp someone of your size to kill you. That is what my build is for: making the opponent incapable of fighting properly and positioning my party so they can kill more effectively. That is why most support mages have traditionally been ice. If you take ice away you ruin it and we should all go fire INT or light and go solo. Now if I was INT fire or light, then yes I would not mind vs. But as HP ice its just a waste of time and pots, only useful when you want to show someone that they can't really kill you.

    Re stealth: that is what lupine is for. As an HP ice mage I don't solo much.


    i would prefer 4 duffers in a party than 2 ice mages. At least i can still attack and move around when im duffed. Then cure when needed. Unlike slow whihc require immediate cure to be able to do anything at all.[/b]
    You guys just look at it from a warriors point of view only all the time. It does not work the same way for all classes. When you are maliced as a warrior you have enough ac to stay alive - therefore you dont need a cure immediately. When you are iced, you cant reach ppl to attack them so you need a cure NOW. On the other hand when a mage is maliced they need a cure ASAP or they will die to the first noob warrior that reaches them. When a mage is slowed we dont nessecarily need a cure urgently. And re blind, some classes can still fight when blinded.



    Question to Havok: when you did your tests, was it in the arena or in cz? Reason I am asking is that the arena used to have a much higher stun rate than real pk and I am wondering if that is the case with ice as well. Because I really don't ice ppl with a 100% success rate. Far from it, both with aoe's and with single spells.

  2. #242
    ArminVanBuuren
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    I'm still wondering if they complain about ice rate when the ice mage is in their own party.

  3. #243
    TouchMyBlade
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    I'm still wondering if they complain about ice rate when the ice mage is in their own party. [/b]
    I dont add mages to the party they always tp me when i dont want one and never when i do, i quit partys with mages in mostley i go solo or in a small party with good melee players. I find it easier to PK without a mage.

    I just dont think you should be able to have whole partys slowed 24/7. light mages cant have whole partys stunned 24/7.

    Im not a warrior if you were wondering.

    What you guys seem to not understand GR DOES NOT WORK. I should be able to raise my GR to the point that you dont ice me often. However only FR and LR actually makes a dent. I dont care what you say about anything else the GR doesnt work properly and if it did then we probally would not even have this topic period.

    I dont need an ice mage to get kill. Any party that relys on the enemy being duffed and slowed 24/7 beofre they send in melee's has zero skill. We beat these 8 ppl partys with they warriros sins ice mages and preists cos they dont have any skill always expect to rely on noobs being duffed and slowed for easy kills.

    Until GR starts working ice mages WILL be unbalanced. Its fine that you want to be able to slow ppl but its like DD no longer working. Thats why your unbalanced thats why you have an advantage.

    Why should a lvl 80 warrior with 200+ GR we slowed by a lvl 45 mage? It should never happen. My suggestions were alternatives to GR working if they fix GR i dont care ill just does up on GR and breeze by ya like it should be.

  4. #244
    Senior Member kerber's Avatar
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    the way i see it is only ice mages defending such a slow rate...heck if i had 95% on my scream i would protect it and give bazillion of reasons why it should stay that way (oooh my only chance when i get duffed, slowed etc etc). ppl would say get yourself a priest!

    so i say the same to ice mages....it is not ice slow rate that keeps you safe from your enemies...its the priest and your other party members in generall :P

    /close_pointless_topic

  5. #245
    ArminVanBuuren
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    I said I'm still wondering because I don't even hit 140 GR with magic shield on, and even without it I never get iced not even close to 70%, as I already said some pages before...with a warrior with 104 GR I don't get slowed so often as you guys may say, so I'm still surprised a bit that you get "always" iced (C'mon, my BP has no more than 54 GR and still I don't get iced more than 50% of the ocasions).

    About mages TPing when you don't want to, then those are mages that don't know how to
    A. Listen to their party
    B. How to TP properly

    Or, you are the one that don't know how to play in party properly (I don't like being TPed all the time either, but sometimes party requires it, so learn adapt to the party work).

    so i say the same to ice mages....it is not ice slow rate that keeps you safe from your enemies...its the priest and your other party members in generall :P[/b]
    What if the mage is running to a spot alone to tp their party strategically? and suddenly he's seen by a bunch of sins/warriors/bps/other mages? So...they might tp first the priest to save them leaving the whole party with no heal at all...or the other members, which cannot heal him, thus not save him?

  6. #246
    Senior Member kerber's Avatar
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    What if the mage is running to a spot alone to tp their party strategically? and suddenly he's seen by a bunch of sins/warriors/bps/other mages? So...they might tp first the priest to save them leaving the whole party with no heal at all...or the other members, which cannot heal him, thus not save him?[/b]
    why would a mage not been spoted and killed? why not? look dude strategy failed, try again, go different way, hide behind attros in bowl....or tp priest then warrior, let them handle run away tp them there...something...whatever. and anyway i will say this again: nobody says remove ice from ice mages or make it not work

    in your example ice mage should TRY to ice them...and not have almost 95% success. if mage fails, is it against some law for him to gate? or run away? nooo...lets make him able to slow every1s ass down

    why wouldnt me as a warrior have "strategicall" ability to scream, shockstun and leg cut with 95% success, those 3 rogues that are on my ass? they can cure anyway...or to strategically save my priest who is getting ganbanged?

    why cant i shockstun strategically with 95% success every BP when i see he is trying to cast duff?

    why cant assasin strategically CRIT with 95% success mage who is trying to tp some1?

    and all these skills are not even close to 80%, crit is a bit more succesfull then shockstun

    why would you wanna give to mage ability to run solo? cause this is basically it...

    if he runs solo he must accept the fact that he can be attacked, its not the reason to make him able to slow every1 down over and over again

  7. #247
    ArminVanBuuren
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    why would a mage not been spoted and killed? why not? look dude strategy failed, try again, go different way, hide behind attros in bowl....or tp priest then warrior, let them handle run away tp them there...something...whatever. and anyway i will say this again: nobody says remove ice from ice mages or make it not work

    in your example ice mage should TRY to ice them...and not have almost 95% success. if mage fails, is it against some law for him to gate? or run away? nooo...lets make him able to slow every1s ass down

    why wouldnt me as a warrior have "strategicall" ability to scream, shockstun and leg cut with 95% success, those 3 rogues that are on my ass? they can cure anyway...or to strategically save my priest who is getting ganbanged?

    why cant i shockstun strategically with 95% success every BP when i see he is trying to cast duff?

    why cant assasin strategically CRIT with 95% success mage who is trying to tp some1?

    and all these skills are not even close to 80%, crit is a bit more succesfull then shockstun

    why would you wanna give to mage ability to run solo? cause this is basically it...

    if he runs solo he must accept the fact that he can be attacked, its not the reason to make him able to slow every1 down over and over again[/b]
    Can you tell me where in my own post did I say that mages slow 95%? In fact, I mentioned that I get slowed but not so often, even WITH A BP WITH 54 GR. I never said they can slow over and over again, because I haven't seen that happen 'till now, and the whole topic I've been thinking you are overreacting about it...if warriors would get slowed 95% of the time, as you guys claim, then I wouldn't be killed at all at CZ, because then the BP that debuffs me would be too far to hit, same as the warrior and I'll be able to run away or run by the side to spot the easier target or take advantage of them being completely stopped by being iced. I don't see your slowing 95% as a fact, just as an opinion...but even so, I haven't seen any proof of the so high ice rate you all claim...95%? not even 70% I'd say.

  8. #248
    Senior Member kerber's Avatar
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    Can you tell me where in my own post did I say that mages slow 95%? In fact, I mentioned that I get slowed but not so often, even WITH A BP WITH 54 GR. I never said they can slow over and over again, because I haven't seen that happen 'till now, and the whole topic I've been thinking you are overreacting about it...if warriors would get slowed 95% of the time, as you guys claim, then I wouldn't be killed at all at CZ, because then the BP that debuffs me would be too far to hit, same as the warrior and I'll be able to run away or run by the side to spot the easier target or take advantage of them being completely stopped by being iced. I don't see your slowing 95% as a fact, just as an opinion...but even so, I haven't seen any proof of the so high ice rate you all claim...95%? not even 70% I'd say.[/b]
    you dont get slowed with 54 gr? i have 240ish gr when i put on a shield, goblin and use gr pot. to me it looks like this: iced, cured, iced, cured, iced, cured, iced, reiced, reiced...i beg for cure...cured...iced god damn it! and enemy party has 2 mages, and 1 is fire mage (!!!) and if it was only party vs party...its a goddamn batallion VS batallion

    only way we found to fight it is to have at least (!) 1 full buffer with bless of god and that is still somewhat ineffective, because he has to heal sometimes and not only throw cure

    2 group curers is best, because they use group complete...group cure...group 960, group cure...and they fill in cure gaps during heal animation for each other

    so if we want to have also a duffer...party is overpopulated with priests...and we also wanna have ice mage in our party :/

    and its not always easy to create "a perfect" pk party (in the way we would want to)...even as an organized clan..ppl dont play at same times and you got some1 missing

    ice succes should be dictated by lvl of mage, his build, his items...lvl of his target and amount of GR that target has...and not just "poor mages cant survive" lets give them ability to constantly ice every1

  9. #249
    Senior Member SilverBlade's Avatar
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    in your example ice mage should TRY to ice them...and not have almost 95% success. if mage fails, is it against some law for him to gate? or run away? nooo...lets make him able to slow every1s ass down

    why would you wanna give to mage ability to run solo? cause this is basically it...

    if he runs solo he must accept the fact that he can be attacked, its not the reason to make him able to slow every1 down over and over again[/b]
    Ice mages don't slow 95% of the time, that is what we are telling you. It is not a 95% success rate. It might feel that way from the victim's point of view, but it is realy not.

    But in any case let me give you an example of 95% success rate: why does any melee that hits me interrupts my spells (bar tp, manes and blade) with almost 100% sucess rate?

    And re soloing: ice mage of HP build (which is the one that can stay alive a bit if ice fails, which it does believe me) cannot solo, because they can't kill. But I find it ironic that you complain about mages being able to solo, given that this whole thread is full of warriors that are complaining because increased ice rate messes with their soloing. :P



  10. #250
    Da Mod Father Senior Member Felix's Avatar
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  11. #251
    Senior Member giga's Avatar
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    im an ice mage right now, and i can say that ice is NOT 100%, there are certain players that NEVER get slowed.
    every so often a human rogue comes to our ew party and tries to raid, prismatic, ice comet, ice impact, solid solid solid solid solid, and he still is able to run away. if ice gets lowered they&#39;rd be no point being an ice mage in pk ><

    btw i use a garp+7 and 1x shio+0


    also, i think ice slow rate is higher for human mages than orcs...
    could be wrong...

  12. #252
    NaidenZ
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    garp+7 has 40 ice dmg..

    maybe that&#39;s why ? ^_^

  13. #253
    Senior Member giga's Avatar
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    garp+7 has 40 ice dmg..

    maybe that&#39;s why ? ^_^[/b]
    +30 from shio
    v_v

    and yea, i kinda thought the low elemental dmg might have something to do with it, but the other guy playing the char insist the intel boosts slow rate

  14. #254
    Da Mod Father Senior Member Felix's Avatar
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  15. #255
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    im an ice mage right now, and i can say that ice is NOT 100%, there are certain players that NEVER get slowed.
    every so often a human rogue comes to our ew party and tries to raid, prismatic, ice comet, ice impact, solid solid solid solid solid, and he still is able to run away. if ice gets lowered they&#39;rd be no point being an ice mage in pk ><

    btw i use a garp+7 and 1x shio+0
    also, i think ice slow rate is higher for human mages than orcs...
    could be wrong...[/b]
    no matter how many shios u wear, u will ice like 2/5 because you are using a Garp +7 xD

    GE / Oasis / Ron staff >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GARP +7 in terms of ice rate

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